Reimagining Creative Briefs in Workfront

Transcript

welcome to today’s customer success workshop. This is all around how Kohler reimagined creative briefs in Workfront. I’ll go through a quick housekeeping section and then I will hand it off to Kerri to share a little bit more about her process. And so just from an agenda standpoint, like I said, quick housekeeping introductions, and then we’re gonna spend most of our time today, Kerri sharing more about the details of how they, again, sort of transform their creative briefs into Workfront. And then we’ll spend the other half of the time on an open Q&A. I know there’s a handful of people joining today. There was a handful of questions that came in during registration. And so we wanted to make sure that we left enough time for you guys to ask some questions and get some real world tried and true answers. And so from a housekeeping standpoint, we are going to record today’s session. So if you are not able to stay the full time, no worries. You’re going to get a follow-up email this afternoon after the session with a link to the slide deck, a link to the recording. And if there’s any other resources that you guys might need, you’ll see that in an email coming later from the csatscaleatadobe.com email address.

I think that’s all I really have for housekeeping. You guys do have the option to raise your hand or come off mute, but I will just ask if you guys can just wait for Carrie to just finish her presentation. Like I said, we left a handful of time today for open Q&A. So reiterating that, yes, this is being recorded. You’re going to get a copy. Don’t worry about taking screenshots.

And then introduction. So you guys are not here to listen to me speak, but I am part of the scale customer success team here at Adobe Workfront joined by Cynthia and Leslie, who are in the chat helping to moderate that space. And then most importantly, we have Carrie Bramstedt here from Kohler. So Carrie, I will ask you to introduce yourself and then feel free to share your screen and share a little bit more about your process.

I’m going to start sharing my screen right away because I do have an intro on my, part of my slides.

So thanks for joining today. I’m so excited to talk about our Workfront forms as creative and media briefs.

I worked for Kohler company and Kohler was founded over 150 years ago. It’s a privately held global enterprise spanning several industries, including kitchen and bath products and luxury resorts and golf courses.

Creative services at Kohler is an internal agency with a full creative staff and a photo video studio. So that’s how the kinds of work that we are trying to brief in.

So we implemented Workfront a little over two years ago and each input for each campaign was a unique PowerPoint deck. We had a whole bunch of meetings where all different people looked at that deck and it was changed for every audience. And those decks may or may not have had every bit of information needed for every creative or producer to be able to do a good job and use that brief well.

And we had a lot of different meetings and each audience got a different deck.

In addition, requesters used different outlines and formats in their decks. So sometimes the core idea was on page one and product details were on page two, but sometimes page one had the target audience and the core idea wasn’t until page 15.

In addition to the creative deck, requesters also were required to fill out a media brief Word document. And much of that information was similar, but we were using different terms to describe them.

And as you can imagine, requesters didn’t like filling out a bunch of forms. They still don’t. Media and creative spent extra time going through pages of decks to find the information they needed to reference. And some of us were in three to four meetings reviewing the same information in different formats.

So we had a trigger to update our work from briefing forms when we had some other process changes. And we had a lot of leadership review and approvals for each of the four steps in our campaign development. We formalized that leadership review and leadership drove a lot of these changes. So they were all, they really wanted us to utilize Workfront as a tool, as the source of truth for our creative briefs and for all of our inputs for creative projects. So our four steps are brief, concept, production plan and final deliverables. And those have to be reviewed by leadership before they’re released into the market. These are for our largest projects.

So our brief that was developed in Workfront to support that process is an all-in-one brief and it’s tended to make it easier for creatives to reference information consistently no matter which campaign they’re working on. It also includes the information our media agency needs for effective buying. And some of the fields help with reporting like the type of campaign, the budget, the media budget and the media live dates. Some fields are referenced as the concepts are developed to make sure that the creative idea is hitting the mark.

And truthfully, everyone still insists on making a beautiful deck for our creative briefing, but they do copy and paste required information into the Workfront request form. And we’re able to use that as a source of truth to with varying degrees of success for creatives. But our project managers and studio producers find the form very valuable and reference it often. We’re hoping that we can limit some of the copying and pasting with use of AI sometime in the near future.

And this is our form is really comprehensive and I’ll give you a preview of the form shortly. But to keep them from getting too long, we did think really carefully about the information needed for each type of project. So our largest projects are tier one and tier two large campaigns, and those have longer forms. They have a lot of information in them. And the supporting tactics have fewer fields and more logic built in.

So some of those fields are reused on both forms to help with both reporting and system administration.

And we use a concepting project to run the campaign through the first two stages. The concept, well, the brief is not part of our Workfront project. The concept and production plan is handled in a concepting project. And then the deliverable tactics each have their own project that are associated with that concept project with a program, which we call a campaign bucket.

So our largest projects, full funnel national media or mid funnel media, they require an approved strategic brief before kickoff. So that brief is fully approved before anyone copy and paste information into Workfront. And we’re gonna create many assets based on that request.

So if you’re a requester, here’s what that form would look like. You’re choosing a tier one and two concept design request. I did make a few changes for this audience to avoid any confidentiality problems.

Okay, we group our projects by business level. So we have a number of business level questions. And then we get into some of the meat of a brief project.

So the objective, the background, these are really high level. There is some additional information about what belongs in each field by hovering over the question marks.

And there’s a little bit of logic built into this large, this tier one, tier two, it’s the paid media section.

And so those questions only will pop up if there is paid media. Sometimes we do have tier one and two projects that have no paid media that will be owned only.

And then we do have a campaign type that we use for reporting.

Scroll down till you find it. So we have a number of different campaign types, but the information that we put in the brief doesn’t change much depending on those large campaign types.

We also build in the information needed to inform the studio that the project is coming. This information does change throughout the project. This is not the final studio inputs, but it is enough to help them understand the scope, the space, the set build type that we’re looking at.

And they find it very useful to know early in the process what’s coming.

The tier three form can either be used for deliverables like an email or a social post or a print ad that supports a campaign, or sometimes we use it for assets and deliverables that are outside of our large campaigns.

You’ll see we call that a tier three new tactics request.

If this project is related to a campaign and the user clicks yes here and they enter the name of the campaign, there’s a lot fewer fields for them to fill out because we already have a lot of that information in the campaign project brief. So they don’t fill out the objective or those high level information. There’s just a few key message about this particular tactic that they would need to fill out about that.

And then the logic magic comes in when you were talking about the specific tactic types.

So the email section, it doesn’t appear until you click email.

And then there’s really specific fields, including the number of deployments, what dates we want to start, the information about each module that will come up about an email.

And for printed materials, we’re going to ask how many, what paper stock, all the specifics that we would need about a print request. Again, those aren’t on the tier one and two requests because people aren’t ready to give that kind of detail. They’re only on our tier three and four requests.

And our tier four form actually looks very similar to tier three, but that is the form we use if you are revising an existing deliverable. So there’s fewer fields. We don’t ask for objectives or messaging key messages at all. We really just ask for what’s the thing you’re looking at and what do you have to change on it? And then I can do a little bit of information about how the logic works in our forms.

So most of our logic is based on the sections of the form. So you’ll see, this is the form builder and the sections all appear in the form builder. So there’s a social tactics section and an email tactics section. And the logic is based on the field. I’m sorry, I’m scrolling really fast. The tactic details field, which is right here, the tactic type. This is the driver for most of the sections that appear and disappear.

So if you click on this section, email tactic, and look at the logic, you’ll see that if tactic type is email, then that section is displayed. Tactic type email is selected, that section. And it’s the same for each of the other tactics.

Now, this has not been a perfect situation for Kohler. We certainly have a lot of challenges in people complaining about having fill out forms, about people complaining about copying and pasting for into forms, but we do have leadership that is supporting the use of the tool and helping us to be more efficient and effective over time. Some of the things that we would like to do next is to try to find a way to be more specific about the video versioning and paid social deliverables and getting those details into lists and reference when they’re developing those assets, because they tend to get really long.

And hopefully we’re going to be using some work from planning for that.

And those were my slides.

So I think there are some questions in the chat. Nicole, do you want me to start reading them or? I think, well, I had asked a few folks, well, I asked during registration if people had questions specific to your presentation. And so first and foremost, Carrie, thank you so much for sort of sharing the backend setup sort of where you were and how you operate today. I think that’s super informative for everyone here on this call. And so my thought process was to just go through, you’ve kind of addressed a handful of these throughout your presentation, but I figured these are the sort of questions, themes that came in through registration. And I want to make sure that these get at least looked at and addressed first before we just start pulling things out of the chat pod. And so any barriers or pushback to moving this process to work front? I know obviously you said you got some leadership buy-in, but any other challenges that you experienced in sort of transitioning this process directly now into work front? Because it was part of some other process changes and there were some trainings that involved all the changes, including kind of how these leadership, these new leadership reviews were going to work or these formalized leadership reviews. There wasn’t as much pushback maybe as even I expected. So the training was extensive across the full process. And this work front piece was just a little bit. So there were other things to push back on. Maybe that was a good thing.

And so teams, go ahead. No, go ahead, Gary. Yeah, no, I was going to go on to like, how long did it take? It was probably took about six weeks to get through maybe the campaigns that were kind of already half in process. We needed to get to some new things that we were going to start this way. And it was just letting the in process work move through before we got to new things. So it really didn’t take very long. And how did we achieve buy-in? Again, this overall process change was presented with leadership approval and there wasn’t a lot, there weren’t any options given. So that was really helpful in getting people to use that. Okay, so changing information, information not ready submission, but required for kickoff.

Because in our tier one and tier two briefs outside of work front are approved in a leadership process, they don’t change that much. Those project objectives, the key messages, they stay the same.

And if it’s not ready, information not ready at submission, we don’t start it. And we’ve been successful in doing that in general.

Of course, some things do change. And that information has to be submitted to the project manager and the project manager will adjust the work front form in the project, not in the request. The request is going to stay the way it was in the request. And then the project manager will log a change order as an issue in that project.

So that’s how we kind of handled. And that applies to any changes that happen throughout the project. That would include brief changes, scope changes, as well as timeline issues, feedback loops, things like that.

So does that come in through, so you mentioned that the project manager so is it just like an offline conversation that someone is having with the PM saying like, hey, this is what needs to change? Or is there like a formal request that is submitted that the PM then, you know, either turns into its own change order? Like how does that process work? Yeah, it’s currently generally a conversation. It is usually part of other project communications, probably part of a status meeting or part of a review meeting. And so the PM is really logging it so that we can refer to it later. And the team has already probably talked through it and decided it. Got it.

I know you talked about the AI, but you know, and the struggle of people having to copy and paste, but maybe just maybe lean into that and expand on what that looks like, how you kind of overcame some of those challenges and maybe what’s next. Well, I think the, probably the important thing, having to copy and paste into the form makes sure that people have covered all the right information in their beautiful deck. Because before sometimes there were key pieces of information that just didn’t end up in the deck. You know, sometimes it was the project objective that just never ended up in there. So when they go to copy and paste, if they don’t have something that fits in that field, they have to go back and rework the brief and get it approved again. So that’s been, there have been cases where that’s helpful and it has changed people’s thinking over time. They know they are going to fill out that form in that field so they develop a way to make that easier as they develop their deck.

And so using AI to help, I just, I have paid attention and I know that that’s coming. We have done a few little tests, but that’s about as far as we are. So looking forward to learning more about that and trying to make that happen in the future.

And so the creative brief submitted, what happens next? So I mentioned our briefs are actually approved before the request is submitted. And our requesters do have the option of exporting their request to share with leadership as part of the approval process. Most of them opt to show their beautiful deck instead of a PDF of text, but that is welcome. And yes, there’s certainly a rejection process if it’s unclear or robust enough. That may happen during the leadership review. Sometimes people go back for multiple reviews if the brief isn’t clear enough, if it’s not meeting the business objectives.

The PM also has the option to reject a request if there is other things that weren’t considered. It’s usually not about the content of the brief. It usually has something to do with the timeline requested, the creative resources that they may have asked for or wanting to use.

And then pushing back on the requester, we would mark the request as rejected, which would send them a notification, a work front notification. But as we always also have to have some other kind of conversation, whether that is a work front update explaining what needs to change before we could accept the request or whether it’s a one-on-one going back to the requester and talking further about how we can do better. So have you mentioned that your approval process happens before the request is even submitted? So typically most requests theoretically should be approved. Have you thought about moving that approval process into work front then where then people submit their request, that is what leadership reviews and approves and then move on? Or is this something that you’re like, nope, it’s kind of working outside of work front and we’re okay with that? Yeah, it is working. The people who are reviewing are executive leadership. So we have VPs and directors who are approving those briefs. So they are working in work front regularly. So it’d be a very different process for them. In addition, they often discuss the business value of the brief during a meeting. So this is a meeting, we have these weekly meetings for people to review those.

Conversations that happen during those meetings are also really valuable to the business.

Got it, makes sense. Okay, those are the sort of overarching themes that you guys had submitted questions during registration. And so I’m just going to stop sharing again. And I know there’s been a handful of questions that came in through the chat. So I’m just, Carrie, I’m going to put you on the hot seat. All right, here we go. And rapid fire here.

Do you have a need to export your briefs to PDF or Word? Generally, no. We have trained people how to do it so they can if they want to.

All right.

Do any of your fields auto-populate from the attached brief if folks submit a written brief with their request? Okay, my, no, because I’m assuming they’re going to have to copy paste. They do still have to copy paste. Eventually we should get there. We’ll have some auto-population.

All right, next question. How do you distill this information to your creatives? Do they see all of this information in the project details? Do you build a report? They see all of it in the project details.

We also have some reports. Most of those are based on an individual’s, a lot of admins don’t like that, but if I can help an individual with getting the to the details that they want to get to faster, we may have a report that works for those individuals.

Makes sense. The campaign field, I know I want to say, someone asked if that was an external lookup. I assume that that’s a type of head field. It is a type of head field. Okay, so whoever had asked, yes, that’s a type of head field.

Okay, hold on my screen.

Let’s see.

What is the criteria for closing the change order issue log to the project? Maybe that’s a question for a PM, but maybe you’ll know the answer. Yes, so it is up to the PM on the project to determine if the change order is still we still need additional inputs or if it’s complete. It’s not a highly formal change order process. We it’s kind of informal. It’s really for us to log and be able to have a list of things that affected changes to our initial plan. So most of the time the PM enters the change order and marks a complete right away.

Makes sense.

Sorry, I’m trying to literally read through all of these things and making sure that some of these that have been addressed.

What does the user profile look like for these? Are they filled out by marketing personnel or is this an intake from a customer? For instance, are users from HR or product development filling out the brief? So generally for our kitchen and bath business, form we have, we also serve our internal audiences. So we have an area of our internal agency that does internal communication. So there might be HR or IT people who are filling out a form like that if they need some of our creative services.

We also would sometimes have that would be most, that would be most. It would either be a marketer or sometimes someone from internal if they are using our creative services.

Got it.

And apologies that I’m on the screen. This is, I have to find all my questions over here.

Okay, do you convert multiple projects from a request with a brief attached? Like how do you, so people are submitting a request. Are you converting these to multiple projects, a single project? What does that look like? Yep, so our tier one and two requests are always converted to one concepting campaign level project.

All right, a tier three request can have multiple tactics on it. So if it’s one requester who knows they need four different tactics, they can fill out one form because it means they only have to fill out the project, that kind of those upfront things one time. And then we would generally convert the project once and then copy that project because we might be able to save ourselves a little time by doing fewer assignments or fewer things like that. But that is an acceptable way to, for our requesters to do something. They can put multiple tactics on one request form and then we’re gonna create a number of projects from that same request. But generally- Is it a project for one deliverable? It’s not quite one deliverable, but it is one deliverable type. So we might have like a paid social request. There might be 15 paid social ads on the request from the same campaign. They don’t fill out one request per ad.

But that same project would not be for paid social and an email.

I know you and I have chatted before and you’re sort of your solo work front champion, but people are curious as to how many PMs project managers are managing work front for Kohler versus how many marketers are submitting requests. So what does that balance look like? Oh, that’s a good question. So I think there are about 12 PMs who manage requests. The request or list is probably in the hundreds. However, some of those people make one request a year or one request every two years. And they need access to do that because they are still required to do a request even if it’s only one a year. So I would think our heaviest users or requesters are probably maybe 40 requesters.

And so then on average, like do you happen to know on average, like how many requests do you think you get a year that you are actively working on? Oh, I don’t know. I will say when we look at project managers project counts, most project managers are managing between 30 and 60 projects at any given time. Now, some of those are those really big tier one projects and most, a lot of them are tier three and four projects, that’s about how many they have active at any given time. And now our producers also own projects. They act kind of as a project manager for projects that are going through our studio team. So that, and they carry about the same amount. They’re carrying probably 20 to 40 active projects at any given time.

And I’m no PM, so I don’t know if that’s a large amount or a small amount, but to me, it sounds overwhelming to manage 50 projects at a time. So, just to your structure, you talked about, I think you called them campaigns as your programs. So if you just want to kind of lay out the structure of like how you sort of organize your marketing projects by like portfolio program project in color terms.

Yeah, so we have just one portfolio that we were using. That’s how we set up Workfront right or wrong. We just haven’t ever changed it. And then we use Workfront programs. We have renamed to campaigns because that was our nomenclature that we were using before we went to Workfront.

So we call them, we use the term campaign bucket because there isn’t a lot of information that’s stored in a campaign. It really is a holder for all of the project lists that are associated together for one campaign.

Then within each one of those campaign buckets, we will always have, not always, we usually have a concepting project that is the full timeline from brief approval to delivery of all assets.

And then we also will have one project for each deliverable type. And that’s all of our paid media as well as supporting our channels. So it’s supporting retail and retail, store, merchandising, email, and web.

Got it. Hopefully that helps to clarify things.

Someone had asked about content calendars. So do you have, you talked about different email campaigns or ads that are running. Like, does this layer into content calendar, do you use content calendars to help sort of visualize this? Yeah, so we have a channel team. We have channel teams that own some of those different calendars. So we’re split up, we have an email channel team, we have a social channel team, and they do own calendars. We are working actively to get those calendars into planning and to be able to then to connect those planning calendars to our projects. It is, it’s a work in process. So a lot of them do use spreadsheets. And then those, either the channel manager would be the person then entering the request based on the information that they keep in their calendar. And they stay in contact with the project manager about changes in the calendar.

Makes sense.

Someone had, and I know you had talked about work front planning very briefly. Someone had asked her on, are you looking at using or planning to use work front planning as part of your campaign process? Is that something on your radar like AI? Yes, it is on our radar. We are using it as a planning tool right now. So we have a couple of users who build out like large campaign views to show how our campaigns overlap and how they might overlap with other things going on in the world or other non-campaign related activities going on at Kohler.

But that connection into our work front projects, we were waiting until kind of after the July update, which would have a lot of the upgrades we needed to help make it worthwhile for users to do less copying and pasting. So now we’re kind of relooking at the process with those upgrades and trying to make some of those process changes.

Constant process improvement cycles. That’s really all it is. That’s right.

Another question here around resourcing, and I’m not sure, you and I have not talked about this. And so this would be news to me, like how are you managing resource allocation and capacity planning, especially for your PMs? Oh, that’s not a good, I’m like, don’t use me as a poster child for that.

Not quite there yet, maybe. Not quite there yet.

Our workload balancer is pretty accurate for short-term planning. So our projects, our work front projects are really good. Our resource planning for the future is really not. I just, we’re bad at it. That’s okay. Again, work in progress.

Maybe if other people have some ideas on how they’ve helped get there, maybe we’ll share some tips back with you, Keri. That’d be great.

Folks had asked around tracking deliverable projects if they’re connected to a concept project. They’re using like cross project predecessors or using custom forums. Like how are you linking these? Generally, they are only linked by being in the same campaign bucket.

It depends on an individual PM may or may not be using cross project predecessors.

The way that those deliverables, because we have these stage one and stage two and the deliverables really come in in stage three, the connection is not that important as long as we have the right deadline for each project. So as long as each deliverable project has the right deadline, connecting them doesn’t end up being highly important.

And I think, yeah, even the fact that you mentioned that they’re all on the same campaign bucket, like you can still report on that information very easily. So yeah, not necessarily a huge priority, I guess, from your standpoint.

Another question came back to size. I know we talked about, you had, I think it was 12 PMs or 15 PMs.

People had asked about how big the creative team is, like the graphic designers, copywriters, photo, video. Yeah, so I guess total, we have about 125 people on the internal agency. So that includes our studio staff, as well as the designers, production designers, and art directors and copywriters. So I’m just gonna count in my head, because, and actually, none of you are gonna know if I’m wrong anyway.

So I think we are probably at about six art director and director level copywriter pairs. They usually work together. And then we have five or six graphic designers, six or eight production designers.

And then we have some media specialists in there, some photographers, some producers.

That’s about the size. No one will know, but around 120 from your internal agency, got it. I’m going to just briefly share my screen, because I know we capped ourselves at 45 minutes for today’s discussion. I’m gonna share like two to three, maybe three to four updates. I forgot how many slides I have here. And then I will leave the last couple of minutes for someone if they wanna come off mute and ask her a question. And so first thing is, last year, there was actually a community.

At the time they were called Community Coffee Chats. You might know them as Ask Me Anything. Think of them as like Reddit style threads. They’re text only Q&As on the Experiencing Community. There was one last year on creative brief and taken best practices. And so if you are interested in like reading what people had asked about or shared their best practices, and honestly, Kerry, I was actually going through this to figure out what were some of the recommendations. And you had shared one of your ideas around tiering projects. And so that’s something that if you guys are interested in more information on creative briefs and how other customers are doing it, Leslie just put that in the chat. Workfront User Groups. This is a really great way for you to just network and connect with other Workfront admins in your local city or region. And so there’s a handful of cities, new ones are being added all the time. I know Utah, Colorado, and Ohio, I think are the most recent ones. So be sure to check out the User Groups. Most importantly, Skill Exchange. This is a virtual learning opportunity for everyone. There’s the Learn Track, which is sort of your, I wouldn’t say beginner, but think of it as like, specific Adobe led sessions on sort of feature function, where you’re gonna have your Grow Track, which is more led by customers. Think of this as like advanced fusion resource management, topics like that. So that’s happening on August 21st from nine to 12 Pacific time.

Our very own Cynthia is MCing one of the tracks. So, and there’s actually a handful of customers on this call who are actually speaking. So love to hear from your peers. That’d be a great opportunity. I’m not gonna go through this. Other events happening this month, the only one I’m gonna highlight are actually the two or three. Next week is a session with Lindsay from IDEX Laboratories on project templates. There’s a fusion session happening with, in partnership with Professional Services, the 19th. And then Southern New Hampshire University is doing a session on Workfront Planning later in the month. And then there was a Workfront Survey published to the Experiencing Community by Jeremy Flores, one of our product managers around strategic planning. And so if you would be interested or able to take that, I’m sure he would love your feedback. And so with that, I am gonna leave three minutes to, Kerry put you on the hot seat for the last few minutes. So if anyone has a question that they want to raise their hand and ask, we would love to have you.

Brenda.

Yes, hey, no, thank you. And Kerry, such an amazing job. I love this.

I did have a question about the change orders. So you mentioned that, and I love that you, you’re using change orders to actually track changes, any type of changes, and that it’s actually the PM because those changes come from everywhere. How does that look in your Workfront project? Is it like a section to track actual notes or how does that look? So it is actually an issue or a request that goes into that section of the project. So if you’re using, and then we use issues for a couple of different things. We also use them to help with studio intake and we use them for post-production intake. But then, so then there’s just a view that’s a change order view that then allows you to see that info, the field information specific to change orders.

So essentially it’s a request that’s filled out. And then, so how does that issue get tagged or tracked into the overall project? Or does it just get assigned into the campaign bucket? It is part of the issues section of the project. Oh, got it. That the tab on the side, the left tab that says either issues or requests, depending on how you name your system, they’ll appear there. We also do report on them, I believe quarterly to like our PM, our leader, our director that is over the project management team. And she looks for things that are the same. She looks for themes and threads going through to see if we can address, often it’s individuals who are causing a lot of changes. Change orders.

It’s a very small world that happens to us a lot. I love this idea. I’m going to adopt this.

I don’t know what you’re talking about. I imagine everyone is, you know, there’s definitely no one or two people who are the leaders. Great question, Brenda. Yeah, it’s really issues on a project and you can log them as change orders, just different terminology.

All right, you guys have one more minute. Anyone else have one last question? Brenda, I’m not sure if you have another question or if you were. I do, I do. I had a question about the video. So, Cara, you mentioned, you know, because we also do video and we’ve actually created different, we’ve created a request form specifically for video to capture all those details because there’s a lot of versioning and details that happen. Have you done the same or tried to create like a form, like for your deliverable group, like you do for paid social, there’s all those details, but do you do one specifically for video? We do not. I mean, not specific to a video version. So we have a request that would be for the unique video content, but when we get to, we need it 1920 by a 1080 and we need 1080 by 1920 and we need 1080 by 1350 and we need it with subtitles and we need it with a logo that’s popped, like all those different versions that lay on top of the unique content. There’s so much information that needs to be copied that’s exactly the same for every one of those. But the only thing that changes is the 1080 by 1920. And I haven’t found that it’s gonna be fair. It’s easier to use a spreadsheet because copying and pasting it for each version is silly. So we haven’t come up with the right form yet where you can easily copy and paste.

And I think planning is gonna be better because planning will work more like a spreadsheet where we could copy down all the information that’s the same about each version and just change the little bits that are different.

Do you have PMs who are specific for video or do all the PMs have to, video is just like a tactic? Video is a tactic. I would say mostly it’s a tactic. We don’t have specific PMs. Now again, we do have producers who support the actual production process. So the PM doesn’t have to do that part, but we are supporting the delivery of the videos to the right people along with any supporting information like post copy or anything else that you might need to go with a video to complete the deliverable.

Got it, okay.

All right, I just wanna remind full of time. Yeah, thank you so much, Carrie. We’re two minutes over. I promised her only 45 minutes so that it wasn’t a full 60 minutes. And so with that, Carrie, I just wanna say a huge thank you. There was so much good information shared around what this process looked like before, what it looks like today, and hopefully gave some inspiration for folks here on the call for maybe what’s next for them. And so I just wanna say thank you again for your time, your expertise for sharing us a little bit more about the Kohler story.

And we would love to have you back whenever you’re interested.

Great, thank you so much. It was a pleasure.

Thank you guys. You’ll get a follow-up email from the scale team this afternoon. So keep an eye out for that with slide decks and recording and let us know if you guys have any questions. Otherwise, have a great rest of your day and we’ll see you soon.